Do you agree with the punctuation?

  1. Never double up periods. If a statement ends with “etc.” the period in the abbreviation does double duty, serving as the full stop to end the sentence. If, however, you need another mark of punctuation after an abbreviation, you can put it after the period. Hmmm. How about a comma after "etc.?"
  2. Place a period after Ms. but not after Miss.  Since Ms is not an abbreviation, why do we have a period after Ms.? Or do we?
  3. Use a comma after a period following an abbreviation: Magnificent Learners, Inc., Wal Flower, and Justin Case are all part of the network.
  4. If you place a comma after "Inc.," why not place a period after Inc. at the end of a sentence, as in the start of this post?

What questions or interesting facts do you have around punctuation? Leecy

Comments

Leecy,

This is an excellent example of the complexities in writing the English language. I can remember when one needed to place a period between the letters used in the abbreviations of  names of states. For example, New York would be, N.Y. However, the periods are now omitted; hence, NY. 

Good period, Grayla, I mean, good point! :) I would love to read more examples since, I you say, the English language can present complex issues.

Just this morning, I wondered how to explain the difference between "further" and "farther." I found one fun tip on  "Grammar Girl's Quick Tips for Better Writing," at http://www.quickanddirtytips.com/education/grammar/further-versus-farther:  "The quick and dirty tip is to use 'farther' for physical distance and 'further' for  metaphorical or figurative, distance. It's easy to remember because 'farther' has the word 'far in it, and 'far' obviously relates to physical distance." It took me awhile to switch those double quotation marks to single ones within that quote! Did I have to do that?

What if we turned grammar and punctuation issues into a game with learners instead of a requirement? Hmmm... What are your thoughts? Leecy

Hello Leecy and others,

No doubt there are punctuation games that some, perhaps many, adult learners would enjoy. However, if they don't see the relevance of punctuation to what they want to accomplish, these games may be regarded as irrelevant. In my experience, learners take an interest in punctuation for primarily two purposes:

1. They need correct punctuation for writing assessments that they care about such as HSE extended response questions.

2. They want their writing to be understood and respected, and have seen that missing or incorrect punctuation may lead to misunderstandings that sometimes may be embarrassing.

Focusing on the second purpose, years ago I discovered that when adult learners were writing something for publication on the web, an article, explanation, or set of instructions that might be read by hundreds or thousands of people, they cared about writing compellingly, clearly and properly. When I showed them some hilarious examples of grammar mistakes or other writing errors, they then understood the importance of grammar, punctuation, and proofreading. They understood that good writing was good communication.

I am a fan of the monthly emailed Worldwide Words column by Michael Quinion. In it there is a section of authentic examples from the media or from various public signs that have been sent in by readers. Here are a few recent ones:

  • On June 15, 2016, a South African cheap-deals site promoted a manual meat grinder that it claimed, “Can Be Used To Grind An Assortment Of Meats And Ingredients Made Of Cast Iron.”
  • The Australian national public television network SBS had the headline in May, 2016, “Americans are being warned of possible terror attacks in Europe over summer by the US State Department.”
  • The title of a summer, 2015 lecture in a Cupertino, California public library: “Replace Your Lawn With Stephanie Morris.”
  • Written in the Rochester Democrat and Chronicle of July 11, 2015 about the poet Adelaide Crapsey: “She never did quite receive national fame or poetic immorality.”

World Wide Words is copyright © Michael Quinion 1996-2015. All rights reserved. You may reproduce this newsletter in whole or part in free newsletters, newsgroups or mailing lists or as educational resources provided that you include the copyright notice above and give the website address of http://www.worldwidewords.org

I am also a fan of Fractured English, and other books by Richard Lederer. His outrageously funny books have authentic examples from students' writings and from public signs. When I discovered Fractured English many years ago in a drawer in a hotel room in Maine, there was a note with it that suggested that the book was better left in the room for others to read, and that copies were available for purchase at the desk. I bought one, and it has been a great source of amusement.

I like Grammar Girl, and recently have been learning from the New Yorker online Comma Queen column.

David J. Rosen

djrosen123@gmail.com

David and Susan, thanks for sharing these resources here. It is so true that, as emphasized in andragogy, adults must match instruction to something they perceive as relevant to their experiences, interests, and needs.  There is also another bit of research that states, "When we are laughing, we are learning." That's one of my favorites! Several sites develop this theme. Two follow:

In that regard, how many here have shared one of the best YouTubes ever, in my view, on punctuation: Victor Borge and his representation of matching punctuation to sounds?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qf_TDuhk3No

Leecy